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Post by Pollik on Jan 6, 2014 18:33:14 GMT
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Post by Firefox on Jan 6, 2014 19:02:31 GMT
He's really going for it, isn't he!
If he wants to do "direct action" the first thing he needs is a motorhome, if he's going to challenge the no motorhome signs. At the moment I believe he sleeps rough in his car.
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Post by Etienne Le Croq on Jan 6, 2014 19:40:42 GMT
The donate button seems to be the way forward , maybe I'll add one to my blog Might get the van finished then !
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Post by Firefox on Jan 6, 2014 19:53:13 GMT
He's really pulling in the dosh now with his donate button! I'm not sure what he does for a living at the moment though. Maybe on job-seekers allowance, he seems to be a full time blogger
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Post by robmac on Jan 6, 2014 19:57:00 GMT
Does he really expect to get moved on by the council between 20:00 and 05:30 sleeping in a car?
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Post by Firefox on Jan 6, 2014 20:04:33 GMT
I guess with the no overnight sleeping signs he is contravening by using just a car. I believe he contacts them beforehand and tells them to issue him a PCN which he will then challenge.
He hasn't got one yet, AFAIK. I've got to admire his organisation and spirit, though some of his campaigns are a little misplaced. He also doesn't know the difference between peruse and pursue, but then English is a devil sometimes.
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Post by robmac on Jan 6, 2014 20:10:03 GMT
I guess with the no overnight sleeping signs he is contravening by using just a car. I believe he contacts them beforehand and tells them to issue him a PCN which he will then challenge. He hasn't got one yet, AFAIK. I've got to admire his organisation and spirit, though some of his campaigns are a little misplaced. He also doesn't know the difference between peruse and pursue, but then English is a devil sometimes. But would the overtime and expenses for a council employee even be covered by the cost of a fine? Surely he will just drive them to erecting height barriers in some places where there is little he can do about it.
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Post by Firefox on Jan 6, 2014 20:27:48 GMT
No it wouldn't cover the cost. I think the councils would just do night patrols infrequently and at random, not when someone has told them they are going to park there.
At Hutoft and others, Lincs CC have now got byelaws signed by the Secretary of State, and no parking between 10pm and 6am will be enforceable with fines. In the end, it's council land and they can enforce what they want on their land legally, given enough will and time.
He boasts about getting rid of advisory no overnight parking signs - that's easy as they weren't defined, but the way he is provoking some of these councils, who knows what will happen.
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Post by Rubbertramp on Jan 6, 2014 20:50:00 GMT
I've already told him on WC he shouldn't be doing this and to let sleeping dogs lie (didn't get a reply). I think others are having second thoughts about supporting him now. It seems all he can say in reply to criticism is "Check your facts". Asking for money doesn't appear to be a popular way to win friends and influence people these days either.....lend us a fiver till the end of the week Vern!
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Post by seanrua on Jan 6, 2014 21:02:33 GMT
I'm on the periphery of all this and hav not followed the antics of this dude closely, but all in all I'm with Rubbertramp on this one. The "donate" button will frighten off many on WC in any case; they ain't too big on parting with their "hard-earned" ( ahem, British military and prison authority pensions ( early retirement, of course)etc.
On the other hand, I said I'd chip in for something on freemotorhoming and don't think I have yet. Can't even remember what it was now ( a fire, maybe?), but put up an address and I'll post some lovve.
Re the councils - they get state aid and usually win in the end, in my experience.
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Post by seanrua on Jan 6, 2014 21:07:57 GMT
In contrast, I regret to inform Mr Strangeway that he'll get f a off me. Charity starts in the tent, blah di blah di blah. Actually, I would welcome an ICV-free country, I think. They do more harm than good and seem to ruin it for everybody.
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Post by Etienne Le Croq on Jan 6, 2014 21:47:06 GMT
Maybe he could use the donations to buy a 3D printer and make a camper!
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Post by kangooroo on Jan 6, 2014 22:26:28 GMT
He's hardly going about this the right way. Exactly what is he hoping to achieve other than causing annoyance and a backwards step for 'wildcamping'? I thought the idea was to get locals, councils etc on side via showing the responsible side of motorhoming/camping...? Mind, in the meantime, if people are funding him to have a free touring break, does he really need to? It sounds like a rather nice paid-for trip to me while becoming a nuisance to Councils and potentially annoying residents at the same time. And, is all his 'camping' taking place in a car? Not even a motorhome to which these apparent regulations apply? *shakes head...*
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Post by francophile1947 on Jan 6, 2014 23:35:02 GMT
I think his actions could well p*ss the councils off, so that they make sure that they enforce the rules. However, if you all send me £20, I'll go and help him
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Post by Is it spring yet, dormouse? on Jan 7, 2014 10:06:40 GMT
Well, from purely selfish point of view I'm none too bothered, and the man will do what he wants regardless. Plenty of other quiet spots in the country to rest up and they are far, far away from the madding crowd! Park and Ride is becoming popular with a lot of congested towns and cities, and you can always walk...
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Post by robmac on Jan 7, 2014 10:29:51 GMT
Well, from purely selfish point of view I'm none too bothered, and the man will do what he wants regardless. Plenty of other quiet spots in the country to rest up and they are far, far away from the madding crowd! Park and Ride is becoming popular with a lot of congested towns and cities, and you can always walk... I agree Marie. To be honest the sort of places he is campaigning are the sort of places I wouldn't go to in a million years!
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Post by Mikehanky on Jan 7, 2014 10:45:31 GMT
I am a simple man with simple thoughs sounds to me this guy is just looking to make a few quid out o us all for the privalage of him parking for free and living of donations well not me
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Post by Pollik on Jan 7, 2014 10:58:22 GMT
I can see both sides, here, but my own leaning is towards Andy.
LAs set great store by the law when it comes to prosecutions. I think of the Bathgate scandal where they were picking up a prosecution every 5 minutes for a 10 foot badly signed bus lane. Their response was that they had fulfilled all the legal requirements. Of course, it wasn't actually stopping people using the bus lane by mistake, but then looking at the revenue it generated, maybe that was the point.
I am also thinking of the many councils that are making profits from car park fines (they are not supposed to in law).
So my view is that if the anti MH signage is unlawful (which Andy clearly believes it is), then it should be removed. I understand the argument that they will probably not police it (although some will use cameras) and that we could wild there with relative impunity, but it strikes me as ethically wrong that a chancer (like me or vern or...) should benefit where an upright law abiding citizen would not. For me, it is not (always) about "getting away with it", it is about establishing rights and about ending the persecution of MHers. There will always be MHers who spoil it for the rest of us by abusing parking/camping rights and probably there is an argument for dealing with them, because they are creating a nuisance. However, most signage that I see seems to be nothing more or less than prejudice against MHs.
And even where some action is needed in order to prevent nuisance, the kneejerk reaction is "Ban them!" Rarely do we see alternatives offered...you can't park here, but you can park there. Often, when challenged, the inflicted bans do not seem to reflect public outcry at MHs...sometimes no complaints at all have been received, or only one.
I see a tin pot attitude with many councils. I would support any council that want to eradicate a genuine nuisance, but mostly that is not what it seems to be about. IMHO.
I would like to see a change of culture towards MHs in the UK and, for me, this is what this about.
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Post by kangooroo on Jan 7, 2014 11:00:47 GMT
I think his actions could well p*ss the councils off, so that they make sure that they enforce the rules. However, if you all send me £20, I'll go and help him I think they'll see him as a crank seeking publicity, refuse to rise to the bait and, on the assumption he'll soon get fed up with sleeping in his car, ignore him rather than give him the satisfaction (aka reward) of a fine.
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Post by Firefox on Jan 7, 2014 11:02:37 GMT
Some points well made, Polly, and yes I am a chancer Life is about chances But I don't see your main aim of "change of culture towards Motorhomes" being achieved by Mr Strangeway. If anything the reverse is true with his taunting approach of "I'm going to flout your signs, issue me with a PCN and then I'll challenge you in court". This is simply turning councils against overnight parking. They'll be annoyed at the waste of their time, and put up some proper laws and signage. It's their land and they'll find a reason. If one is going to flout no overnight parking, I'd say do so quietly, leave the next day, and don't ruffle the council's feathers. Your TMCTO has a better approach towards change of attitude. That group promotes information, dialogue, and reasoning with the councils, working with them, not against them. Mr Strangeway's confrontational approach fails to take into account human nature in the mix.
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Post by Pollik on Jan 7, 2014 11:27:02 GMT
Which would probably upset the locals? Actually, do I remember some locals in Scarborough reacting against such a plan? Or am I indulging in wishing memories?
I think that there is room for many types of protest. Wasn't there going to be a "park in" by MHs on the east coast somewhere, after a local council decided to ban them from car parks?
I would prefer to be able to discuss matters like adults, but with some councils (like Hereford and Bath) it may not always be possible.
Ah, well.
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Post by Firefox on Jan 7, 2014 11:32:20 GMT
Yes, all councils are different, as are the locals. Some locals welcome tourists, and the business they bring. Others just want the nice areas all for themselves and would prefer motorhomes packed like sardines in a "holiday" park.
Still... the best way is to engage in dialogue with a non confrontational approach. Hopefully councils which don't listen will change in time, especially if tourist income is lost.
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Post by kangooroo on Jan 7, 2014 11:33:43 GMT
I would prefer to be able to discuss matters like adults, but with some councils (like Hereford and Bath) it may not always be possible. Ah, well. Eh? Herefordshire Council allows overnight parking in some car parks...
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Post by Pollik on Jan 7, 2014 11:38:54 GMT
Yes it does.
I should have made it clear that I was thinking about other issues, Edgar Street in particular, where the cabinet has been outright secretive and withholding important information from councillors, let alone the general public. My point being that when a council becomes fixated on something, it is not open to rational discussion, it digs its heels in and becomes a diktat. It's Our County has plenty of tales to tell.
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Post by Is it spring yet, dormouse? on Jan 7, 2014 13:04:05 GMT
Yes, all councils are different, as are the locals. Some locals welcome tourists, and the business they bring. Others just want the nice areas all for themselves and would prefer motorhomes packed like sardines in a "holiday" park. Still... the best way is to engage in dialogue with a non confrontational approach. Hopefully councils which don't listen will change in time, especially if tourist income is lost. I agree with the dialogue and non confrontational thing, problem is, a lot of councils don't even know tourist income exists, let alone that they might lose some! The lack of good people who've worked in the commercial world outside of the ivory towers of authority is the main problem. Gawd, I'm sounding a bit like Wintonian! It's 15 years since I spent a brief year or two with a local tourist authority, and one department of a public authority rarely talks to another, or shows any interest in "outside" affairs - and communication across geographical boundaries is as rare as rocking horse sh*t. You can get a few really good, imaginative people, with progressive ideas, but they are more usually seen as a threat and sidelined, or squashed in some other nefarious way. But - maybe that's just Northern authorities? They are extremely political animals (at the top of the sh*t heap, that is) and I don't know whether the economic depression of the last 5 years has educated them or not. Doubtful. That'll happen when the moon turns to cheese! You need a whole mountain of determination, plenty of spare time and the patience of Jove to tackle some issues - and be prepared to wait a looooooooong time for any change to occur, unless you're lucky or have special "friends at the top", aka councillors in your back pocket. Cynical? Moi?! I bet you never guessed
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